The Unreal Marketplace Improvement and Feedback Thread

Distribution UE Marketplace
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1121

“In the long run customers quit buying.”

I don’t think that’s what would happen.

You see, customers buy plugins/assets to save time, and time IS money.

Also, your argument is coming from the needs of the buyer/customer and completely disregards the needs of the seller to build a sustainable business from their talent or work.

“Subscription forever” maybe flawed, but “subscritption for updates” is better.
If you bought a plugin, you can use it perpetually, But there could/should be a fee to keep receiving updates. This model where the seller has to support you for a lifetime when you contributed only $20 to their bills is completely wrecking and detrimental to the seller.
Basically, you want to give once, but you want to keep taking and demanding and taking without any further giving. This is not a healthy relationship.

I’m pretty sure you want the plugins/assets you buy to keep getting updated and maintained whilst also being AFFORDABLE.

Well, in the current environment, sellers have little to no incentive to keep updating /maintaining their plugins.
If you bought the plugin at version 4.24, you expect updates through 5.3 regardless of the time passed through this.

Please think about sellers, they are also trying to make profit/benefit/ pay bills just like you the buyer, trying to make money from your game.

People will always spend money on something that saves them time and helps them reach a goal. Look at all the other marketplaces like Envato or the WordPress plugins ecosystem.
Most charge per year, so that they can afford to keep updating.

The alternative to charging buyers $20, is charging them like $900 upfront (lifetime updates and support) or something higher. Now who does this benefit and how is this feasible?

Let’s be realistic and look at both sides of the table, not just one side.

1 Like
1122

That is just nonsense.
I am not using Unreal Engine and buying assets to have fun but to create myself games to sell to end-users/customers.
So by your logic every seller of any game on Epic Games Store, Steam , GOG or any other online shop should start asking money to customers to deliver updates ?
Large software houses with their AAA games could even manage to get away with that maybe thru marketing brainwashing BUT small software houses, micro-software houses and solo indie developers like myself would just see sales of any product falling down to zero.
More fees customers have to pay less customers you would end up with.
Games bug-fixes and updates have always been free of charge. And that must not change.
Marketplace sellers here asking for fees on developers to get updates would just be the same huge mistake of enforcing paid updates on customers of games sold on online shops.
Everyone wants to make money but adding more and more fees on products is a very bad thing. A few might end up earning more for a period of time but most sellers would end up earning way less or nothing.

1123

Nonsense? Wow what a mature response!
And I don’t want to believe you can be this selfish even in real life.

Instead of responding/touching on all the concerns I laid out that affect sellers, you’ve done nothing but talk about your problems, and your fees as a buyer, and completely ignored the very FACT that the seller too is trying to make money and feed their family and make their own ends meet with their Plugins/Assets.

This is the problem here, you’re just thinking of yourself and not who you run over to get your way.

“So by your logic every seller of any game on Epic Games Store, Steam , GOG or any other online shop should start asking money to customers to deliver updates ?”

Let’s see;

  1. Gamers who buy your game don’t get the full source code to your game

  2. Gamers DO NOT expect endless lifetime updates to your game. they merely ask the game to be stable and ask you fix bugs if any. You don’t see GTA 1 Gamers demanding Rockstar to give them GTA 2, 3, 4, 5 ,6 and beyond infinity… cause they paid for GTA 1.
    Neither do you see them demand Rockstar keeps updating GTA 1 forever and forever.
    Are you going to expect to get Assassins Creed 4 for free cause you paid for 3?

  3. Gamers DO NOT package and resell your product/game for their own profit or gain. They merely play the game, not package it with other things to make money.

  4. Well Game Developers Actually DO have recurring revenue models implemented in their games that allows them to keep that game updated. Do you seriously think Cod Mobile would still be constantly updated without its Monthly Passes/ skin purchases? Fortnite? Do you seriously believe game developers who have apps in the app store would still update their game if the Ads shown didn’t create recurring income for them?
    have you thought about why GTA 5 has been running for this long/with the updates this long? You don’t think it’s cause the online creates recurring revenue for rockstar from the people who demand updates?

TBH, I don’t even know why you even tried to make this comparison, I could go on and on… wow…

Plugin And Asset developers are not your slaves that you can just pay $20 and say you work for me now… for a lifetime… i own you. I sold you a plugin and at the time you bought it , it said it would work for Unreal Engine 4.26. And it works for Unreal Engine 4.26. I don’t owe you updates for 4.27, 5.0 , 6.0, 7.0,… 25.0… ? As a seller we are doing it as a courtesy , not because you’ll have a valid claim for a refund if we don’t. We said it will work for 4.26 projects, it works for 4.26 projects… you read the description. nowhere does the epic marketplace license guarantee you “this seller will update this with each engine version for LIFE” when you purchase.
please be serious, and stop thinking about yourself.
OR here’s an idea, go build those plugins yourself with that $20. see how that turns out for you

1 Like
1124

You are the childish one here.
No. 99% of games you don’t have to pay anything for the updates. They are free of charge.
Source code access to end-users what ? That is nonsense. What else is that ?
End-Users / customers of games meaning generic gamers are not programmers, coders, developers… almost everyone of them knows nothing about how to assemble a game.
You trying to compare apples to oranges , completely different markets and customers types is a childish attitude. You and other marketplace developers thinking like that should stick with reality instead of asking to twist rules and adding some crazy fees that would just cause the whole market to collapse sooner than later.
That is what anyone like you wanting to endlessly raise prices just doesn’t get. The market collapses when you make it too expensive to sustain itself. More fees added thru the chain sooner any market would collapse with only a few able to keep going.
Take a look at the new Unity Runtime Fee model what’s happening over there… all the micro-developers, micro-software house, solo developers are going to lose a lot of money because Unity management went the “let’s be endlessly greedy mode”… only those selling many copies with high revenues will be able to pay the fees without going bankrupt or losing any kind of profit from their products. Anyone selling a game having to pay per-install of their product is just insane and something that applied to the market of today is just going to end up collapsing it that way.
If Epic Games would follow the same path things would get even worse and all indie developers would have some serious problems developing games … adding so expensive fees into the chain is just wrong.
For the UE Marketplace at worst developers like me might accept having to pay a cheap, meaning $5 to $10 monthly subscription to access it which could then cover the free updates concerns of sellers like you if Epic Games would want to give a split of the revenues collected thru that. That could be the only way to really do it. But thinking of having to pay each and every seller something like $1 or $3 or $5 or $10 for each update of anything or something like that just wouldn’t work, it would be too greedy like the Unity Runtime Fee nonsense and would sooner than later cause the market to collapse.

1125

Wow! Amazing!
I like how you keep scoring these own goals by yourself.

“You trying to compare apples to oranges”

Exactly Sherlock!! Exactly! That was my VERY point in my last reply. Who started comparing plugins/assets to games? me or you?
Wasn’t I just merely showing how flawed your comparison is? And somehow I’m the one comparing apples to oranges??

Moving on…
Here you go on again talking about the Unity license…
Same thing… I’m not even going to respond to this one cause it seems you can CLEARLY see when someone is going off-topic. Seriously why are you going on about Unity as if we are arguing about Epic changing it’s engine’s license? Stick to the topic and as you said , stop comparing apples to oranges.

“You are the childish one here.”
Really? I’m the one who resorts to calling opposing views nonsense when I don’t have a better argument and just blatantly dismiss valid points without even addressing them?

The reason you can not focus on the topic and beat about the bush is this ,

You can not dispute the fact that it’s very unfair to expect sellers to provide lifetime updates without any recurring revenue when most plugins/assets go for around $20. You just can’t justify that. It’s exploitative at best.

Besides… Why are you trying to force the seller’s hand?
Let sellers choose if they want to implement charges for updates/ or just give them for free.

LET the market decide.

Sellers who don’t mind doing it for free, will do just that, do them for free
Those who want to implement a subscription model can just tick a box. You’ll be clearly notified as the buyer before you buy if the seller charges for updates.
If a buyer like you minds, they can go buy elsewhere. And that’s fine. We are not forcing you , and you are not forcing us.

The laws of supply and demand will settle it.

If you want to keep things civil between discussions, you better learn not to throw the word nonsense around, and reply in a civil manner. And other people will keep it civil with you. Or else we’ll end up with what we have above.

1126

So your only goal here is trying to let others insult you at any cost , uh? You keep replying like I offended you personally or something while I only kept telling that adding more and more fees is not going to make you or anyone else earn big money.
And no telling someone of acting in a childish manner and writing nonsense is not insulting, it’s just telling what is obvious.
If you said that 1+1 = 5 because you want to earn more and people told you that is nonsense because 1+1 = 2 you would then tell that you got offended by that remark ?
I already told you multiple times that everyone is in any business to make money and everyone wants to make more money BUT there are limits that shouldn’t be trespassed otherwise the market would collapse on itself. There is nothing new about it, it kept repeating thru the history of humankind in completely different markets.
The “let the free market decide” thing rarely has been really true. Actually nowhere in the world there is a really free market, only attempts at that, some better and some worse.
Fact is if you alienate customers and keep adding fees any market would end up collapsing sooner than later.
Then you can keep going and act like you don’t bother or you don’t understand that but I doubt that is the case. It is just that maybe you dislike the idea and you want more money whatever the case no matter what.
Yes on the UE Marketplace I saw some sellers starting increasing their assets prices again and again but how much money they really got out of that compared to selling to more customers at a cheaper price would be the real question…
Adding updates fees and after that maybe asking a subscription fee and then maybe asking for an additional license fee and so on is not going to bring in more customers = more money. No one can increase product prices ad infinitum… and for some products the wall that breaks an actual increase in revenue comes sooner.

1127

:eyes:
…Yeah…
Let’s agree to disagree my friend…

1128

Well, it’s our creation. Why would they own it for life? Do Devs give their Game for life? No they don’t. They ask customers for in app purchases or subscriptions, so It’s the same thing. We create their game visuals and often times functionality… so of course we have all rights to ask for a STABLE / CONSTANT compensation.

Currently, these Studios aren’t hiring anyone… they’re just milking our products. That is what it doesn’t work.

** And no, they won’t stop buying. Simply because their Game WILL BREAK due to those “Static Meshes or Blueprints” not being renewed.

1 Like
1131

In regards to this whole update debate that seems to have hijacked the thread:
This problem has existed with software since software was invented. It will always exist and it should be up to the developer how they handle it. This shouldn’t be something forced or controlled in any way by the marketplace.

No developer wants to keep improving and bugfixing their software that nobody buys or that they are no longer making money from. You see a lot of abandonware and failed projects on the marketplace even to this day. This abandoned failure garbage clutters the marketplace and diminishes its overall utility.

It’s not good form at all and it shows just how amateur most sellers here are. That may be something Epic needs to deal with by setting abandon limits, but they have no business in managing subscriptions.

So, what is the solution?
It ultimately comes down to choice. No business wants to limit their choices, but neither do any buyers. Do developers want Epic to force some kind of standards? Or, do the developers want to be in control of their own properties? Does Epic wanting buyers blaming them for making subscriptions a feature? Not likely!

What are your options as a developer when the cost of time in updating a software outweigh the profit you are making from it?
That’s up to YOU to decide, it’s YOUR problem!

You have a lot of choices already at your disposal.
You can:

  • Abandon it like most do and look like a trash business person.
  • Advertise your product into new and emerging markets, stay on top of your work!
  • Keep updating it because you yourself use the creation in your own games.
  • Set up a system on your website for priority paid support.
  • Start a patreon to let your loyal and understanding customers help you.
  • Whinge and argue with other developers about it in a forum thread.
  • Beg Epic to enforce your ideals for you.
  • Etc.

There is no one size solution or perfect solution, but the best is typically just create things you plan to use yourself and you will always keep it updated and fresh, then advertise more and diversify. Attempting to leverage the power of the marketplace in your particular biased favor is nothing but a fast way to a totalitarian hellscape where nobody wants to buy anything!

If your finances are struggling, you have only yourself to blame and only yourself to look to for a fix. Take some dam responsibility for yourselves, spend less time flinging mud at each other like children, and focus on your business!

1132

“This shouldn’t be something forced or controlled in any way by the marketplace.”

I think most you are either deliberately missing the point or you just don’t get it.

Just to clarify: What we are asking as sellers is for epic to stop FORCING US sellers. We are NOT asking Epic to FORCE buyers anything.

Currently Epic’s Marketplace FORCES sellers to:

  • Provide Full Source Code For Every Plugin (You don’t need this for it to run by the way).
    As Opposed to what you way ask:
    Well Epic could Allow the Seller to setup VERSIONS where one version s Just binaries ONLY, and the Other is Full Source.
    Sellers who just want to sell binaries , can sell just that Binaries. Those who want to sell both can sell both.
    In this scenario, we are NOT Forcing the Buyer anything. They can avoid buying from sellers who sell binaries only and buy from other sellers.

  • Provide Lifetime Updates:
    Currently as a seller, if you sold your plugin say for $20. Epic Games FORCES the Seller to provide Lifetime updates to that specific buyer.
    As Opposed to what you may ask:
    Let the Seller Choose if they want to offer Lifetime updates, or Yearly Updates.
    In this scenarios , we ARE NOT FORCING the buyer anything. If the Seller opted to assign his product yearly updates, the buyer has the option of just not buying from that seller or buying…

  • Sell to Everyone, including Enterprises at the same price.
    Currently Enterprise companies like EA or Activision or some big short company pays the same price as the little guy. This hurts the little guy because it prevents us from setting a price that solo indie devs can find affordable because the big guys will just take advantage and abuse this.
    As opposed to what you may ask:
    Well , different licenses/pricing per company size!
    As an individual , i don’t know why you’d complain about this? Unless you’re speaking on behalf of your company who’s been taking advantage of this setup.

Moving on…

I’ll now try to respond to your argument that revolves around “That’s up to YOU to decide, it’s YOUR problem!” and so on and so forth…

My friend, if Epic Games uttered these very words, that would be so rich and unbelievably hypocritical of them given the way they are going after Apple’s App Store and Google… Everything you listed under “you have a lot of choices” could be said to them.
To be honest, this is the most childish way of looking at things…

“If you don’t like it leave” :eyes:
“It’s my way or the highway” :clown_face:
“Go build your own marketplace” :clown_face::trophy:

It’s like me telling you to leave America or Pakistan or Nigeria or wherever when you start calling for change/reform. Your solution is silence the opposing views :yawning_face: :sleeping: boring

1133

Daily tracking stats for our catalogs to see which products are getting views and if pricing adjustments need to be made to facilitate more sales.

1 Like
1134

Allow us to block certain sellers, I am tired of seeing the spam of AI-generated assets :roll_eyes:

3 Likes
1135

+1 for this, there are so many reasons to want to exclude specific sellers in a search or even browsing. Make the marketplace as enjoyable and convenient for buyers as possible and sales will increase!

1 Like
1137

+1 for stats

1138

+1 For this.
And also allow sellers to block toxic buyers

1139

I spent the better part of the past year carefully creating a modular system to sell specifically on the marketplace. Designed as a “Complete Project” that allows the end user to easily add their own assets while utilizing component driven features.

After an hour or so of ‘careful review’ it was outright denied for “being too complete”. The asset in question is very similar to one already being sold, with better more detailed documentation, more modular components, and a more polished example to learn from.

The ‘review’ completely ignored just how modular the system is, and just classed it as an ‘already complete game’. Isn’t that the point of a “Complete Project” and the point of having a demo for potential buyers to play? This ‘complete game’ was made for the DEMO, the system behind it allows for any model and effects assets to be added.

Dealing with the opinions of individuals and going through such rigamarole just to publish an asset is patently absurd. It not only wastes Epic’s money on these ‘reviewers’ as stepping stones, this ‘review process’ doesn’t even ensure quality! It is just an arbitrary hurdle that exists for no reason.

This same asset took me all of 20 minutes to put onto artstation, with no lazy and inept pompous clown standing between me and that goal.

The review process is archaic and the people that handle it are lazy and inept, perhaps even malicious. So many bad products have made it through, yet good ones are given lame boilerplate corporate drivel denials without any actual recommendations or suggestions on what exactly to alter or fix.

The process is a long drawn out back and fourth that empowers individuals with zero accountability to pick and choose what they think is appropriate or not. The guidelines are not even respected or followed, and the whole process is done via email with no incentive to care for the sellers time or schedule.

If the unreal marketplace is just going to treat creators like garbage, play favoritism, ignore guidelines for quality and utility, and leave the whole process stuck in the stone age, it will eventually drive any and all good developers away to other platforms.

1141

There is one thing you can do. They don’t control the host server, so just pull it down or remove the “Project File Link” (edit product).

1142

Suggestion.
If the content is only sold on this site, then show those assets more often. Some stores reduce % for exclusive content, but Epic take only 12%, so only show the assets more often. And show plugins more often (I write plugins :slight_smile: ).

1143

I don’t know of anyone actually reads this but my suggestion is to add a sorting mechanism on the marketplace where we can sort assets based on the number of 5 stars they recieved

1144

Are you planning to add subscriptions? Some plugins and assets need to be updated with new features from time to time, but there is no additional revenue for this work. It’s wrong for a user to buy an asset in one go, but the developer should keep that asset up to date and working continuously for a one-time fee.

4 Likes