Google Daydream

Google just announced their new VR platform called “Daydream.” This will operate with new phones that are being released this fall, in a fashion similar to Gear VR.

Does anyone have any idea how to build for this product? If it is possible in Unreal, I would assume you would work similarly as you would in Gear VR.

I really wanted to be excited about Daydream, but after I read the details, I am not.

UE4 will probably have SDK integrated eventually.

I’m for one super excited about this - more quality mobile VR devices the better! :slight_smile:

And going by this press release:

CCP Games Readying ‘Gunjack’ Sequel For Google Daydream VR Platform

Can we assume UE4 already supports it? Would be great to get some info from Epic about it…

It was listed as done and in 4.12 on Trello previously I believe

I am not saying people shouldn’t be excited, but standalone device would be a better option.

For once, it’s a certification program. Not everyone (Apple won’t) will go for low latency high ppi screens on their phones. Those who will comply, will only have it on top models and market share of those isn’t as big as Samsung’s.

By the time it’s all said and done, we would probably have new Gear VR out, and Samsung’s standalone HMD out too. Considering that Daydream certified phones won’t have positional tracking, and Gear VR might get an accessory (standalone will have it for sure), I don’t see why should anyone go for a Daydream certified phone instead of keeping their old phone and go for full VR experience with Samsung’s standalone HMD.

I really hoped mobile VR would tap into Apple’s userbase, which is huge, but I don’t see it happening any time soon.

Not to mention pace at which Epic implements Gear VR / Android functionality. Having another SDK in addition to these would definitely slow thing down even more :frowning:

However, I like the input device for Daydream. Gear VR really needs something like that.

Btw, Google VR for everyone  |  Google Developers - no Unreal Engine 4 listed.

The official UE4 Google VR docs are live and you can find them here.

Please let me know if you run into any issues using them.

That is awesome news Sam :slight_smile:

Also interesting is the UE4 Daydream tech demo video already:

The controller alone makes it already better than the Gear VR imo

Brilliant, Sam. Daydream is a great opportunity for developers. Thank you, Epic team, for this strong showing for mobile and Google VR. You hit the bullseye this round. :slight_smile:

Btw, would I have to buy yet another $800 phone + headset to develop for Daydream? :confused:

From what I’ve learned from the live streams today, to develop with/for all Daydream features requires Android N running on a Nexus 6p, which appears to be $500 to $550 for an unlocked model on Amazon, along with a Cardboard headset and a second Android phone with the controller app. Edit: Daydream Hardware  |  Google VR  |  Google Developers

In the Twitch Stream earlier today, it sounded like current non-Daydream capable hardware could prototype in a Cardboard mode; and that it is possible to utilize Vive controllers as protoypes by disabling their positional tracking and limiting design to the trackpad and an app button.

There ya go:

Right, and that link says it’s not representative of Daydream. So basically you shell out $550 now, and then when Daydream phones come out, you’d obviously want to get actual thing to polish your app/game. Quite costly :confused: And if I have no Vive and no second smartphone, I am out of luck developing for Daydream remote. There was no indication if Daydream VR can be used without remote.

Once thing is clear for sure - Samsung / Oculus can’t build hype the same way Apple / Google can. Very unfortunate :confused:

Both I and my almost obsolete Note 4 agree, actually. However I’ve just come to accept that VR development is both expensive and a financial risk, requiring degrees of both foolishness and fearlessness. None of us can really know what will emerge as a path to success for each of us.

Another thing that is clear, at least from my perspective, is how the developer ecosystem which Google is offering to solo devs and small studios, right now, far exceeds what Facebook is offering with Oculus at this time. I am uncertain, or less confident than I used to be, that the Oculus Platform will be an accessible and thriving platform down the road; and that even if it does succeed, that I will like or want to be a part of what it turns out to be - or if I will even be able to release something on their platform, considering their current position and attitude toward indie developers and feedback. Maybe that will change.

Google is positioned to build the most advanced AI in human history and is on a different level. If VR is a modern gold rush, today it felt like Oculus is a giant wagon train heading west, while Google just unveiled the railroad and invited everyone aboard. And if only ten percent of the non-VR developers currently on Android and Unity turn their attention toward VR after this week, that will mean hundreds of thousands of new developers. It also feels like Google is taking a page from Epic’s playbook and offering education and community tools to the developer community in an open way. At least it felt that way today. There’s more than just marketing and hype in what Google is doing; though the hype and conditioning are undeniably potent and almost trans-humanly orchestrated.

I’m debating whether to get on the train or not… still feeling a bit burned by jumping on the Mobile VR Jam’s hype last year and it still burning a hole in my wallet. However I feel fairly confident that Google’s path forward with VR leads to a potentially more attainable and successful income model for solo devs and small teams - and that when I finally pay off this Note 4, my next phone will be Daydream compatible.

Plus I can imagine an HTC Daydream compatible device that responds to Lighthouse and offers positional tracking while at home.

Well, it only becomes expensive if you begin jumping from platform to platform. I am sticking with GVR, but I don’t see Epic being enthusiastic about it, so it makes me want to leave VR scene and get back to PC/mobile.

How so?

What makes you say that?

IBM already built it. I don’t see connection between most advanced AI and VR.

Epic made its fortune being closed as it can be company, capitalizing on closed console market. It only opened up recently because they had to reinvent itself to stay afloat. It’s a calculated business decision (which I have no problem with).

Google is well known for starting projects, luring devs in with hype, then not making money with it and shutting the project down. Works for Google either way, not so much for devs.

That’s where you lost me. Daydream phones will comprise a top tier of devices. Something S6/S7/Sx/NoteX are now. We are talking $600 - $800 range here. Plus HMD with controller. And that’s the rage for non-Samsung devices that don’t have special sensors and screens. So either manufacturers will have to “eat” additional costs, or phones will be more expensive.

Daydream will work just like Cardboard does now - laggy mess, SDE, slow performance. I don’t know of anyone who made living making Cardboard apps. As a matter of fact, most apps/games for Cardboard are free.

So, I don’t see how you are going to generate income on Daydream any different from Oculus platform. Openness is a straight path to trashing your store. Look at Steam - they just became “open” with Greenlight, a few years ago. Before that it was a closed platform you could hardly gotten into. And that ensured lower saturation, higher profit margin for indie devs, and better overall experience for end users.

Don’t forget that Google will also have curated section of their Daydream store. So you would have to go through the same obstacles you do with Oculus.

As for Note 4 you have, what makes you think you wouldn’t buy some HTC phone that will become obsolete in a year or two ?

Unless you already own expensive Vive, you’d have to buy Lighthouse separately. Valve/HTC told me that maybe in the future they would sell Lighthouse/controllers separately from Vive.

I am not against Daydream. I am just frustrated with Epic not finishing support for one VR platform that already has grown to a certain potential, and jumping to support another platform, that isn’t even in the flesh yet (not even settled on the papers).

@Epic: Do you guys have 2 teams, one GVR and one for Daydream?

The link given in the blog post for getting the needed plugin is giving a 404 error. What is the correct link to get the DD plugin to test this out?

Thanks for reminding me why I don’t post anymore. :frowning:

I’m not looking for an argument nor to be the Debbie Downer of the Google Daydream thread. It feels like your questions don’t have a genuine interest behind them. However I will give some of my time this morning to answering anyway before tuning into the I/O Live Streams today (, in case there is a genuine interest in understanding, buried behind your frustration at Epic; and for anyone else following this thread.

Might not be a bad idea. VR is a competitive industry promising billions in revenue to the lucky who succeed. Epic is making tools available to enable and empower us to participate - yet in the end, if things don’t work quickly enough then it’s up to us to figure it out on our own or someone else will.

I read your other thread on the Gear VR Wishlist. Nick Whiting responded and gave you the best answers that he can. So here’s the truth… some of your list will likely show up before the Fall of this year; some will have to be left to the side; and some of it will likely never happen. Unless you learn the C++ to code it into the engine.

I went all in with the Gear VR platform. Have a Note 4, an S7e, an Innovator Edition and retail Gear VR. Did the deep dive with Unreal, FMOD, Unity and the Oculus SDKs - just like everyone else who did here. I have genuine admiration and respect for the handful of developers from this community who made it onto the Gear VR platform this year and hope that they are succeeding financially. The platform seems much more closed this year than it was last year, with a higher bar to entry, at least for now.

I’m not jumping from platform to platform. I’m searching for a path to success through this industry, for my family and I, while staying above water.

Do the research and decide for yourself.

From my perspective, the difference is obvious and doesn’t need explanation.

Google has been aggregating Search, Location, Imaging, Translation, Text and Voice data for… a long time; and has been running all of that data through a Deep Machine Learning network larger than the world has ever seen, with software that was just recently open sourced as TensorFlow. The AI companion from the movie Her, or the Librarian from the novel Snow Crash, is likely going to be built by Google. Maybe IBM, Microsoft or Facebook will be the one who does it first - however while they are all playing Chess, Google is playing Go. That’s the best way that I can describe it.

In about ten minutes there is an I/O Stream on Machine Learning: Google’s Vision. Maybe check it out. Yesterday one of the sessions was on Machine Learning and Art. One of the CodeLabs is called TensorFlow for Poets. The What’s New with Project Tango session yesterday was mind-blowing and had the head of Google VR, Clay Bavor, come up on stage and participate in a selfie with a dinosaur.

The connection to VR is clear for those who have eyes to see.

@Akshara: So, did you at least break even with Gear VR ?

I’am very excited about Daydream, i think it combines the best of all platforms.

-Mobile VR with Vulkan.
-Motion Controls.
-Curated Store without a fully closed ecosystem.
-High adoption rate due to Android.

Oculus are shooting themselves in the foot with too many restrictions. Vive is currently more like a prototype and Steam as a VR store lacks quality control.
Google can take the VR throne if they do it right and i hope for a very strict quality control, far away from the PlayStore, the AppStore or Steam.

Biggest misconception I keep seeing. Adoption rate won’t be any higher than Gear VR. Daydream phones will be expensive. Current flagship product of Huawei is P9. It’seems less powerful than S7 and already costs ~$900+ . Imaging adding hardware and screen to make it Daydream certified?!

So either it will be as or more expensive than Gear VR + Samsung flagship phone, or manufacturers will have to eat the costs.