No, it’s not the same. I can make a game that will release on iOS and Android without restriction, with UWP I can only release on Windows Store. And Windows is not the same as iOS.
You have a ton of new indie developers who can be lured into it if MS will cut royalty percentage and do free promotions. Over few years you can have a considerable amount of people shopping there instead of steam, especially taking into account that smaller games (mobile ports) won’t even bother with publishing on steam. Steam is very unfriendly to new customers right now because of low quality control. Windows store can become more popular if they just do quality control higher than steam for a year or two. What do you do then? Revolt? You can’t convince other devs to leave all at ones, the store will stay there and people will ***** about it but keep selling on it to not lose to competition.
iOS apps are restricted to App Store.
You aren’t restricted from putting them from anywhere else, and the platform wasn’t like Windows where you could put whatever you want on there before and then changed
It is incredible how easy it is to fool you people.
What you mean by fool me? Did you watch that movie? Or you are assuming that i am apfel fanboy and that is some apfel propaganda movie. No it is not any apfel propaganda. I am not their fanboy, and i know they already lost that battle. This move shows exactly why “I have nothing to hide, I do not care” mindset will bite everybody hard in the ***.
I mean this:
If you think that there were a “battle” is enough. Total meaningless and fake advertisements and still it worked like a charm.
btw,
ask Jennifer Lawrence if she is worryied that her phone could be unlocked -.-
That is exactly the problem, nobody really cares about their security, all they do is they say they care. That is why I have my job in IT security since 2000, and there is no sign i can be without work to do in my life. And best thing is that they already had methods to break into apple, all this buzz is just about doing it officially. And nobody cares. But we are derailing it from microsoft to apple.
Imo no corporation in IT should ever get monopoly, that brings only bad things.
Doing something with your own product is not monopoly. Windows is Microsoft’s product so they can do whatever they want. They can make their own store and allow apps to be installed only from their store (like Apple is doing). If anyone doesn’t accept it, there are other platforms to choose. For users, for developers.
About UWP, Microsoft is going to enable VSync and GSync and fix other technical problems so games run without any problem.
Unreal lost mobile market because Unity came first. Who knows, the same thing may happen again.
Unreal doesn’t have the mobile market because it doesn’t support lower-end mobile hardware very well. As for UWP and Windows Store, if they ever want to have any level of user adoption, they need to sort out far more than just the VSync and GSync issues. Rise of the Tomb Raider was supposed to be a Windows Store ‘crowning jewel’ product, yet that version is now two or three patches behind the Steam version (which doesn’t also have any of the numerous issues the WS version has, and you can install it on other operating systems without repurchasing).
Windows is practically already a monopoly in and of itself; it’s installed on almost any out-of-the-box PC you can possibly buy (try getting a linux machine off-the-shelf). Blocking third party applications from everywhere except the store doesn’t mean said applications will move to new platforms, it means they’ll either have to conform to Microsoft standards, or they will simply die.
Unity is not the best choice either. It doesn’t give enough performance, when it comes to a good mobile game. It was just first and got the market.
There are always issues in the beginning. They will fix them eventually.
Exactly. So, what if Microsoft succeeds? Will Unreal die or will Tim change his mind?
I hope Microsoft will change their strategy and don’t block third parties. But, they are within their rights if they want to do so.
Eventually being the operative word. They’ve had four years so far, and still have very fundamental issues with their platform - it doesn’t give me a whole lot of hope.
The Unreal Engine isn’t strictly a Windows application, it’s a development platform that targets whatever platforms high-end games are most prevalent on. If Microsoft kill off PC games (e.g. by locking out Steam), the console markets still exist.
Microsoft aren’t within their rights to block out third parties from their platform, competition law in many countries is quite specific about what constitutes monopolisation of the market, and Microsoft are in a unique position where they are cannot be seen to impair competition on the common market. They’ve been hit by anti-trust suits a few times over far less significant things than shutting out third party development.
I wouldn’t worry too much. UWP was mostly meant as another attempt for MS to finally make some money in the smartphone market, and that’s failing hard. Again. Nobody is developing for Windows Store. And people certainly don’t want another store for PC games outside of Steam, except maybe those anti-DRM evangelists that are already snatched up by GOG.
Can’t blame MS for trying. Apple, Google and Valve are doing it. Oculus hopes to do it for VR games.
UWP is not exactly metro or windows runtime. It’s extended, changed to work on pc, xbox, tablet, phone. It’s not as old as it seems to be and big enough to take time.
Yes, console market. And xbox will accept only UWA leaving UE with PS and some other minor platforms. After that who uses UE only for PS, when there are other engines?! Competition is not as before now.
They can block out third party stores, like others are doing now. And Windows has competition (well, it may have competition). As @franktech mentioned manufacturers have freedom, users have freedom. You can use linux, for example. It has commercial distributions with support.
Please, don’t get me wrong. I’m not here to protect Microsoft’s rights. But they can do it. I merely said what I think may happen.
UWP on the PC is the Windows Runtime and it has barely changed; it’s the Windows Runtime merged with the mobile runtime and extended to support newer devices.
Microsoft aren’t stupid enough to enforce UWP on games on their own closed hardware platform. Their walled garden would literally kill their platform when it comes to games; developers like to work very close to the hardware when it comes to consoles.
No, they can’t, that’s the whole point of competition law. Microsoft are so heavily established as a dominant market force that they are not in a position to start preventing third parties from enjoying the freedom of the platform that they currently have - to do so would be an impairment of the free market. They are legally obligated in numerous territories to behave in a certain way - this is why their dodgier versions of the operating system are generally only available in places like Africa, where competition / anti-monopoly laws don’t apply. It’s also why they cannot bundle Windows Media Player with the operating system any more; it’s seen as detrimental to the health of the market when it comes to media consumption.
You can’t just ‘use linux’, because you can’t just go and buy a linux PC off the shelf in any retail or most online stores, it’s just not an option for the average consumer.
I agree that Microsoft closing down Windows in a single step would be untenable, as we’d see an open revolt by users, developers, and publishers.
But, imagine a gradual series of forced-updates to Windows that each add incremental new OS features that only work with Windows Store or Xbox Live, and incrementally add friction to win32 apps and software from outside the Windows Store. The UWP “side-loading” option, which defaulted to “off” when Windows 10 shipped, was the one example of this friction, as was Windows 8’s limiting of some of its most-marketed new features to the closed API. Over the course of dozens of updates over several years, Windows could be closed down through a series of carrot-and-stick maneuvers, finally reaching a point where only developers and power-users would regularly obtain software from independent sources.
This is the real scenario I worry about, as no single forced-updated would be so onerous as to cause a revolt, but the cumulative effect would be to close Windows down without complaint. This is why Epic is taking a position on UWP now. If we head down this path without clear and specific technical commitments to openness by Microsoft, it will be impossible to back out, lacking some sort of dramatic regulatory intervention.
Would you mind saying something about SteamOS or IOS too?
None of them have a market monopoly and IOs is “closed” only on mobile. Which is again was pretty clear from the beginning.
btw, I’m not saying that 2 thiefs make an honest person BUT, you since there are multiple alternative I don’t see where the problem is.
If you think that Windows 10 is not good, then use another operating system, but as a CUSTOMER!!! not as a provider of a “multiplatform” game engine!
This just hurts us, maybe we like UWP or maybe we don’t, just let us choose instead of choosing for us instead.
and why is that? They spent billions just writing an OS, they didn’t sell any hardware till a few years ago.
You can’t blame them cause they provide the best OS there is.
The best way to fight this is to provide a valid alternative, not wining cause they are taking profit from their own product.
edit:
" IOs is “closed” only on mobile" is just funny