Substrate - Feedback Thread

If you are using RT translucency, all the parts you see “behind” a glass, will use Lumen scene lighting. You see what it looks like by using the view mode Lit > Lumen > Overview, and see what could be expected. You can improve the lighting by using “Hit Lighting mode in Lumen”.

/Charles.

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Thanks found the problem.

Thanks for reporting! I have filed a bug on us. But I would need more information:

  • Is that only happening with substrate enabled? What is the material graph for the clear coat? Using the SubstrateShadingModel node? Or the SimpleCleatCoat node?
  • In which UE version?
  • If 5.7, with Legacy GBuffer or Adaptive GBuffer?
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Is it known that Global Illumination for CPU Lightmass is not working with Substrate enabled in UE 5.7.1? No matter wether Adaptive or Blendable GBuffer. In UE 5.6.1 it is as well not working.

Is GPU Lightmass working for you?

Unfortunately GPU Lightmass doesn’t work for me.
I can test at home, someone send me a codesnippet to visualize the GI in materials somehow but only to test wether they are baked but not correctly rendered with substrate.

CPU lightmass baking was working at some point that is sure. I have not checked 5.7 but it is broken in 5.8 indeed you are correct. Adding it to the list. Thanks for reporting.

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Thanks, I will let you know after trying this CVAR.

Hi Sebastien,

Perhaps not the place to respond but Lightmass has not worked for several versions - at least on Mac. I’ve submitted Bug Case # 21973930 regarding this.

Wasn’t substrate also supposed to give a fix for these white rims when roughness fades from any value to pure black? I tried horizontal and vertical layers and there are always white rims eg. around puddles.

White rims around puddles is realistic and what happens when you go from rough to smooth. What isn’t realistic is the white halos you get when you go from metallic to non metallic.

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Yes. And if the fast Blendable GBuffer (legacy) mode is used, metallic edges won’t also be fixed since Substrate will be forced to use the BaseColor/Specular/Metallic representation when writing to the GBuffer.

One must use Adaptive GBuffer to leverage all the features of Substrate.

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yes, I checked around with the team and there is some work to be planned and done to fix Lightmass.

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I have a question.

Where is the promised Substrate material pack?

It was said in several places that it would be released after 5.7 to help people get started with Substrate.

I don’t know wether it is the correct thread to ask, but can you make translucent materials available to the “IsSky” flagged materials so translucent materials are rendered into the realtime skylight reflection capture? This would save me and other people (afaik the UDS plugin, which a lot of people use, has the option for 2d clouds as well) not using the volumetric clouds a lot of trouble with 2d translucent clouds as well as manually defined sort order of those.

Currently only marked dithered is possible and it is ridiculously noisy and it flickers a lot due to missing fixed sort order.

Best regards

Out of curiosity how is Substrate’s feature set affected in desktop forward shading? Given there are (I am assuming) no gbuffers available?

Hi, i just wanted to ask about the toon BSDF, does it work with baked lighting and does it still retain regular reflections? because if that is true that would be a incredible lifesaver

Lots of questions this morning! Let me try to answer.

  • Promised Substrate material pack: we have a material pack focused on Substrate and car materials that will soon be out but I do not have a date to give right now. I will check.
  • Real time reflection capture and translucency: not the right place to ask indeed since it is not Substrate specific :slight_smile: . For that to happen we will have to make sure we can have translucent unlit only since at this capture stage we have no lighting data. And the capture color buffers have to automatically always be cleared (to make sure no garbage is visible). Doable, a bit of work. I added a note in my todo list.
  • Substrate’s feature set affected in desktop forward shading: it should work the same way as forward today: no SSS for instance. Only simple volume in the case of substrate. And closure count will follow the project setting restrictions (we have not separated forward and deferred settings for now). You can simplify forward shading yourself using parameter blending or restrict yourself to a single slab also to remain cheap there, especially if using forward shading.
  • Toon BSDF, does it work with baked lighting and does it still retain regular reflections? That is TBD and we will see were we end up with options at this stage. There are so many use cases and visual targets with toon shading… But I imagine there is an option to retain regular refelction yes. Not sure it will work 100% with baked lighting at this stage also, TBD again as this is very early development now.
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Unlit translucency is totally fine, there doesn’t have to be any lighting data. Thank you for taking that onto your list. That is a desired features for me since skylight realtime capture was implemented in UE4.

Anyways, where should I ask to request such feature? it feels like you are the only dev responding to bugs and features.