Is EpicGames planning on major renderer upgrade?

[A-J-K]

@ZacD

Generally in CE, the GI isn’t good enough for clean interior spaces. Sure, with a lot of effort and tweaking, it can be acceptable, but that’s not ideal for a game where you go between indoors and outdoors.

​​I’m not talking about a dark, dirty, or visually noisy scene where it’s easier to mask or hide lighting detail.

Not sure what you talking about, for me it looks pretty good considering its not baked… And keep in mind this demo is 3 years old and using a older version of the dynamic GI system in CE.

[4K] CryENGINE Baron Haussmann - INSANE GRAPHICS | [UHD] [Ultra HD] [2160p]

[Maximum-Dev]

@ZacD

Generally in CE, the GI isn’t good enough for clean interior spaces. Sure, with a lot of effort and tweaking, it can be acceptable, but that’s not ideal for a game where you go between indoors and outdoors.

​​I’m not talking about a dark, dirty, or visually noisy scene where it’s easier to mask or hide lighting detail.

But that doesn’t say how it could make it look ‘dated’. You don’t even have local IBL in unreal, indoors in CE without GI are still superb compared to unreal. Given we are comparing dynamic lighting only. It doesn’t make sense otherwise.

[ZacD]

[quote=“A-J-K, post:22, topic:119559”]

Not sure what you talking about, for me it looks pretty good considering its not baked… And keep in mind this demo is 3 years old and using a older version of the dynamic GI system in CE.[4K] CryENGINE Baron Haussmann - INSANE GRAPHICS | [UHD] [Ultra HD] [2160p] - YouTube

It is very splotchy and noisy, too soft and losing detail, light bleed is everywhere, etc. The light bounces and occlusion just aren’t at the level they need to be for a AAA game this generation to be considered good.

Sure its better than nothing, and of course UE4 is lacking some of the basics when it comes to dynamic lighting. But hey, at least there’s custom IBL probe solutions for UE4 out there.

[A-J-K]

@ZacD

It is very splotchy and noisy, too soft and losing detail, light bleed is everywhere, etc. The light bounces and occlusion just aren’t at the level they need to be for a AAA game this generation to be considered good.

Sure its better than nothing, and of course UE4 is lacking some of the basics when it comes to dynamic lighting. But hey, at least there’s custom IBL probe solutions for UE4 out there.

Not for a AAA game this generation? Are you sure we are talking about the same engines here ? Have you seen Hunt Showdown or Kingdome Come? Maybe Star Citizen?
Cryengine has probably by far the most good looking and useable fully dynamic GI solution of all engines right now. When talking about light bleeding, thats a problem you will find even with lightmass.

CRYENGINE V - Hunt: Showdown Tech Demo GDC 18

[ZacD]

@A-J-K

Not for a AAA game this generation? Are you sure we are talking about the same engines here ? Have you seen Hunt Showdown or Kingdome Come? Maybe Star Citizen?
Cryengine has probably by far the most good looking and useable fully dynamic GI solution of all engines right now. When talking about light bleeding, thats a problem you will find even with lightmass.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ffxd-vFspcs&t=49s

I was adding to a past comment where I was saying it’s not good enough for clean interior spaces. Hunt Showdown, Kingdom Come, and Star Citizen don’t feature clean interior spaces. (Plus Star Citizen might as well not be considered a Cry Engine game at this point).

[A-J-K]

I can agree that when you are looking for these super clean interior renders “vray” or hight lightmass settings like, you wont get them from Cryengines SVOGI. However for games, interior or exterior i wish we could have this in UE4, especially with the same performance like in cryengine.

[Cytokinetik]

VXGI seems like a pretty good solution, better for interior use but still usable for outdoor environments if tweaked correctly. I think if one were to use lightmass importance volumes in combination with VXGI on just one directional light or skylight, it can end up looking pretty good. Also Vray can now bake the lighting inside of UE4, there is even a free 30 day trial although I couldn’t get the Vray plugin to compile using a custom engine build for some reason.

[A-J-K]

@karma4jake

VXGI seems like a pretty good solution, better for interior use but still usable for outdoor environments if tweaked correctly. I think if one were to use lightmass importance volumes in combination with VXGI on just one directional light or skylight, it can end up looking pretty good. Also Vray can now bake the lighting inside of UE4, there is even a free 30 day trial although I couldn’t get the Vray plugin to compile using a custom engine build for some reason.

VXGI looks amazing! The Performance is sadly far far away from CE SVOGI.
For VRAY you get just a single frame, right? its not like you can bake with vray and than walk around in your scene?

[BrUnO_XaVIeR]

Vray is a classic “offline” raytracer, that kind of tech was never built with real-time in mind.
I think it was born with the first 3D feature films like Toy Story and etc where realtime render was never needed.

If I understand it right, it never sends anything back to the 3D scene, it only takes info from the many buffers and build a bitmap image from that info.

[Cytokinetik]

I am not sure if the Vray plugin “Vray Bake” option is 1-to-1 as it would render in Max or Maya, but there are several quality settings to play with…It is a gpu baker though and fully usable in realtime, it hooks into default ue4 lightmass somehow with lightmaps and everything. It’s worth a try anyway, I will do a high quality bake and upload a demo if I get time…

I noticed with VXGI if you lower stacklevels and mapsize along with cones/sparsity, it begins to only eat 1-3ms which I mean, wouldn’t even lower fps below 120…but of course I don’t think it is console compatible. VXGI 1 might be though, if using 4.18.3 or before

[A-J-K]

I just took a look at vray for UE4, looks not really different than lightmass for me. For me it feels like im getting much better results with GPU lightmass.

Vray for UE4

Webinar: V-Ray for Unreal

[pxlntwrk]

Hi,

@A-J-K

For me it feels like im getting much better results with GPU lightmass.

testing Vray for Unreal since it is out, and for now i’m think you are right, GpuLightmass is far better and faster…

I understand that Octane render wait in a corner, to make his appearance in Unreal …

OTOY and Epic announce OctaneRender® 2019 for UnrealEngine 4

[Luoshuang]

The grand renderer refactoring is now available on GitHub: https://github.com/EpicGames/UnrealEngine/commit/b5d7db368977e263092be9b97f78944739f80476. No new feature added currently.

I’m expecting 4.22 to be the most unstable release though.

[II_ADN_II]

@Manoel.Neto

The problem with the existing “cheap” methods is that all of them have quite large trade-offs that are oriented to specific kinds of usage. The craziest solutions you see from GDC talks are all from in-house engines and laser-trimmed to each game they are used on.

In my opinion the biggest priority should be making the render and lighting pipeline as extensible as possible without sacrificing efficiency. Because with that in place, several community and marketplace projects will be able to be worked on in parallel versus having one renderer that is very good at one thing only, like CE where outdoor scenes look great but it’s really hard to get indoor scenes to not look dated.

So what is exactly the benefit of not having a usable realtime GI at all compared to CE? Indoors in UE look great with baked lighting, I dont see how using realtime GI like CE could be a step back.

@Luoshuang

The grand renderer refactoring is now available on GitHub: https://github.com/EpicGames/UnrealEngine/commit/b5d7db368977e263092be9b97f78944739f80476. No new feature added currently.

I’m expecting 4.22 to be the most unstable release though.

What are the changes?

[FHC_Disco]

Any news on that? Hyped already