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    #31
    Originally posted by franktech View Post
    What's the crux of this....

    At best Win10 & forced updates means Microsoft will make it harder for users to locate or access other stores to buy games?
    Or at worst, Win10 & forced updates may mean Microsoft only endorses its own store, and blocks others including Epic down the road?
    Or M$ starts downgrading its API's, so that apps written outside UWP work badly, then we get 'Lotus / Wordperfect' antitrust all over again?

    M$ have a strong reputation for being outright anti-competitive. Forced updates seem a lot like their Trusted Computing scheming...
    Can we 'root' a Win10 PC like a phone to buy games direct from all websites anyway? Will this be possible with future versions of Win10?
    Or will secret trade agreements like TTIP, TPP or TISA actually make it illegal in some territories to jailbreak / root / alter a Win10 PC?
    If so, it won't just be about store choice, it'll be a return to region-blocking or something worse, where certain games may not even run...
    and they want to kill all firstborn children too! why nobody is worrying about that???

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      #32
      seriously, it's been years that people complain about Microsoft, and now we have Apple, SteamOS and Google-fake-android.

      if you are not gonna support an environment, someone else is gonna do that.

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        #33
        Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
        and they want to kill all firstborn children too! why nobody is worrying about that???
        No, I believe that's Autodesk & Adobe

        But there are open-source alternatives to both of them (Blender / Gimp etc).

        This isn't the case for the OS as UE4 support for Linux is only partial.

        But if Epic were to change priorities it could be. Please stop writing Tim...
        Instead give us full Linux support for UE4. Then we'd have a real choice.
        If M$ does go all draconian, then we're not all locked in. (Choice is good)
        Last edited by EntrpriseCustomr; 03-05-2016, 04:47 PM.

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          #34
          Originally posted by franktech View Post
          No, I believe that's Autodesk & Adobe

          But there are open-source alternatives to both of them (Blender / Gimp etc).

          This isn't the case for the OS as UE4 support for Linux is only partial.

          But if Epic were to change priorities it could be. Please stop writing Tim...
          Instead give us full Linux support for UE4. Then we'd have a real choice.
          If M$ does go all draconian, then we're not all locked in. (Choice is good)
          why bother? they are talking about target platform, not developer platform.
          I mean.. it would be nice to be able to use the editor with linux but an additional target platform would be far more usefull

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            #35
            There's no problem on M$ intentions; if they close the platform, SteamOS takes over and life keeps going.
            The problem Tim sees here is that M$ intentions may become a wall to his own business in future.
            But consumers don't need to worry about this, if M$ do such a stupid thing as get rid of Win32, then even NVidia could enter the arena and strike big with a new Win32 compatible OS.
            | Savior | USQLite | FSM | Object Pool | Sound Occlusion | Property Transfer | Magic Nodes | MORE |

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              #36
              Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
              why bother? they are talking about target platform, not developer platform.
              Sure, but the switch needs to start with developers. We've all been addicted to M$ & Windows for way too long.
              M$ are no innovators, they never were, they're holding us back! Its a good time to break free...

              Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
              I mean.. it would be nice to be able to use the editor with linux but an additional target platform would be far more usefull
              You obviously see potential in this new M$ target platform that I don't, can I ask why?
              Sure the new platform may be in demand if M$' Win10 forced upgrades strategy pays off.
              But we've seen backlash from Win7/8 users, and its not like mobile M$ devices are big sellers!
              Last edited by EntrpriseCustomr; 03-05-2016, 08:00 PM.

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                #37
                Originally posted by franktech View Post
                Sure, but the switch needs to start with developers.
                I didn't choose to make apps for iphones, and still I have to do it now.

                Originally posted by franktech View Post
                M$ are no innovators, they never were, they're holding us back!
                you don't know what you are talking about

                Originally posted by franktech View Post
                You obviously see potential in this new M$ target platform that I don't, can I ask why?
                A new layer of abstraction over hardware and operating system, composite and upgradable, the same code that works with multiple platforms (and with xamarin it could even reach android and ios in the future),
                many languages available and all of them (including javascript) can compile natively.
                Even just the API itself, the way it is presented and architected is enough to understand the benefits that you can get.

                Originally posted by franktech View Post
                Sure the new platform may be in demand if M$' Win10 forced upgrades strategy pays off.
                Every website upgrades without asking you anything, you just download the new version each time. You don't like the new version? You can use something else and they loose a consumer.
                I'm quite happy with windows 10 and I found absurd that in this world of Facebook and Apple you have to say something about Microsoft.
                (and btw, I like facebook and apple too)
                Last edited by MaxiHori; 03-05-2016, 08:22 PM.

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                  #38
                  Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
                  I didn't choose to make apps for iphones, and still I have to do it now... A new layer of abstraction over hardware and operating system, composite and upgradable, the same code that works with multiple platforms (and with xamarin it could even reach android and ios in the future), many languages available and all of them (including javascript) can compile natively. Even just the API itself, the way it is presented and architected is enough to understand the benefits that you can get.
                  Interesting stuff... So you genuinely believe that some day (hopefully soon) we'll have the 'write-once run-anywhere' legendary promise, where games made for Windows will run flawlessly on iOS etc? And all this because of UMP and the purchase of Xamarin..???

                  Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
                  you don't know what you are talking about
                  Its just a discussion, no need for slurs... Before, I was referring to how innovation-wise, M$ ripped off Office from Lotus & Wordperfect, stole Windows from Apple, and created MS.Net because of jealousy over Java etc...

                  Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
                  I found absurd that in this world of Facebook and Apple you have to say something about Microsoft.
                  Because that's the theme of the thread?... Honestly not sure how FB factors into this.... I just want to see long overdue change and real OS choice, and Linux is a very qualified open-source alternative that brings that choice. My hope is it will lead to new stores and new target platforms beyond the few dominant ones we have now...
                  Last edited by EntrpriseCustomr; 03-05-2016, 11:19 PM.

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                    #39
                    Originally posted by franktech View Post
                    Interesting stuff... So you genuinely believe that some day (hopefully soon) we'll have the 'write-once run-anywhere' legendary promise, where games made for Windows will run flawlessly on iOS etc? And all this because of UMP and the purchase of Xamarin..???
                    No idea about games but as for apps in general yes. Xamarin already provides "forms" in xaml.

                    Originally posted by franktech View Post
                    Its just a discussion, no need for slurs... Before, I was referring to how innovation-wise, M$ ripped off Office from Lotus & Wordperfect, stole Windows from Apple, and created MS.Net because of jealousy over Java etc...
                    as I said, you don't know what you are talking about.
                    and everyone starts from something that already exists, if their products were worst or the same than the old one, everyone would have stayed with the old ones.
                    "jealousy over java..." come on, how old are you??


                    Originally posted by franktech View Post
                    Because that's the theme of the thread?... Honestly not sure how FB factors into this.... I just want to see long overdue change and real OS choice, and Linux is a very qualified open-source alternative that brings that choice. My hope is it will lead to new stores and new target platforms beyond the few dominant ones we have now...
                    FB was for the privacy factor.
                    as of Linux, I dont' see the point. The goal is to have UWP as an additional target platform, not to add a developer platform. There is no gain there

                    Comment


                      #40
                      Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
                      if their products were worst or the same than the old one, everyone would have stayed with the old ones.
                      M$ were judged in law to have a monopoly for years! That meant they could bundle whatever crud they wanted with new PC builds. Even today when you walk into a store, there are very few alternatives if you're buying a PC or Laptop. That's not merit, its monopoly! Forgive me, but I'm now tempted to ask: 'how old are you'?


                      Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
                      "jealousy over java..." come on, how old are you??
                      Well, old enough to remember this ... "There are certainly people in the big house that have Java envy," Box said. "I know that for every Java idea there are probably three different implementations of it in .Net floating around Microsoft."


                      Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
                      as of Linux, I dont' see the point. The goal is to have UWP as an additional target platform, not to add a developer platform. There is no gain there
                      Obviously not everyone can agree with you there. I've no particular love for Valve, but I do think their pro-Linux stance makes sense: Why Linux is the future of gaming...
                      The reason why desktop Linux hasn't made it is because of its lack of games.
                      ....


                      Originally posted by MaxiHori View Post
                      as I said, you don't know what you are talking about.
                      You like sparing on the forums ... Its kind of pointless though, because as the saying goes, 'the fight's not in here, its out there' (getting games made and competing on the marketplace)... Arguments over which tool is better never go anywhere, because the answer inevitably comes down to: 'The best tool, is the one I'm using right now"... But hey, from one Microsoft Pro Developer to another, good luck to you dude!
                      Last edited by EntrpriseCustomr; 03-06-2016, 12:37 PM.

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                        #41
                        gave up, not interested anymore.

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                          #42
                          If MS really want to windows store to compete with steam then why stopping Unreal for supporting it? It is not like Valve funding Unreal? I mean every platform is already competing to each other. It's really the customer's choice what platform to use.

                          Well MS is still the 3rd player in mobile market. Small % is still a percentage but there's still a lot of hate towards MS... this I fully understand.
                          Sorry for my bad English...

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                            #43
                            A little heads up: it is possible to upload Win32 apps to the Microsoft Store, including Unreal Engine projects. Here's a guide.
                            Anything the mind of man can conceive and believe, it can be achieved. Napoleon Hill

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