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    #16
    Absolutely not sourcing it because it's on the same page as this thread on these forums.
    If you are not willing to scroll down a page or use a search button, how do you expect to make a video game.

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      #17
      Maybe I don't "expect " to make a video game cuz I've already done it .Now importing all from udk ,need to do staff with BP .And pabam ...Pure magic thanks to EPIC.
      P.s BTW found a post about Slate as you told me.https://forums.unrealengine.com/show...ueprint-Access -0 information. Right now Slate for me is just a word.
      Last edited by Korben; 04-15-2014, 07:38 AM.

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        #18
        @Korben:
        See this, from the thread you linked

        As for blueprint and WYSIWYG support, there are some really tough engineering questions that we need to answer. They all come down to this: "do we build a whole new UI system that is targeted at WYSIWYG, blueprints, and rich motion graphics? Or do we evolve Slate to add all those features?" My preference has been to have one unified UI system. In the next few days we will be hashing out the engineering implications of the two options. If we do decide to evolve Slate, we'd have to consider how much compatibility-breaking API changes are acceptable. What if certain operations on widgets begin asserting? What if all the ArrangeChildren() or OnPaint() implementations require an overhaul, and your code no longer compiles until you've re-written those functions? How much breakage will you put up with? Are we going to be slowed down by the sheer amount of existing Slate use-cases such that we cannot make significant forward progress on features?

        Once we've settled on a solution there, those of you looking at our code will probably start to see the new features added.
        Please stay tuned. If you have thoughts on any of the topics I touched on above, I'd love to hear them.
        So what part of WYSIWYG UI Editor + Lack of Scaleform doesn't equal an effective replacement?
        Seems to me like you're trying to just get into semantics now, and you're getting defensive, as well as giving off an "I want it right now and don't want to wait for Slate and Slate probably sucks even though i didn't look into what it is" kind of attitude.

        But if you think developer posts are "0 Information", then gladly refrain from reading them.
        Having a more open mind about new things is what gets you responses that are less blunt than this one.
        Last edited by Xendran; 04-15-2014, 07:59 AM.

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          #19


          Yet another thread that turned extremely hostile extremely quickly.
          KITATUS
          "Information shouldn't be behind a paywall, It should be free for all!"

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            #20


            Here is the situation. My Game is 90% complete. It is in the testing and bugfix phase. The UI is already designed in Flash as it was brought forward from an earlier prototype done in UDK. I would have continued in UDK and finished the game there to have access to what i wanted if I had a programmer or even a scripter on my team but I do not so the Blueprint system was very effective for me.

            I have spent a lot of money using 3rd party tools for UI in both UDK and Unity. I can tell you and affirm from experience, this is CURRENTLY the most efficient, nicest, and easiest to learn method available. Now I can go directly to the source but Autodesk sometimes seems less interested in Indie Developers and more interested in "Commercial Products" grossing more than 1M USD annually. That doesn't make them the enemy or overpriced, it just makes them selective and I appreciate that. Not everyone can own a Ferrari...

            So my thought on the matter was, if Epic could negotiate that deal on behalf of their subscribing Indie developers, and offer an integrated tool that they themselves use, then so be it and we all win.

            In posting this I have learned that there are a lot of people that think they know something about something and that is fine. I have worked for a AAA design studio as a UI Designer on a current released Xbox 360 title... So I know what I need, I know what I want and that is it for me.

            All I can say for the others out there, explore options outside of the comfort zone. If you are in need of a UI solution you should check this out. It is integrated and available and FREE with UDK. I know that is the sticking point for most of you... Free and easy. I get it and that is all good. BUT sometimes if you want something to be a certain way you might have to spend some money.

            I can assure you that you can learn Flash (That you can get for around $40.00 or subscribe monthly too for around the same price as UE4...Not that over priced), learn actionscript, learn how to use the Scaleform tools and integrate a fully dynamic and beautiful UI (HUD, menus, etc.) in less time than you can learn and implement a simple comparable UI using a tool that has next to no documentation and has only been publicly available for a month.

            I have no doubt these tools will grow and become more accessible. If I had a bunch of money I would invest it in Epic because I trust that they will do great. But sometimes some people need tools that they can do exactly precisely what they want/need to do.

            I dislike that this is such a long post but I felt compelled to organize my thoughts into useful information.
            Mike "Z"
            UI / Game Designer
            LinkedIn

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              #21
              sorry guys , didn't want to insult anyone ,again sorry.Xendran ,you wrote very good sentence,I understand that you were talking from my point of view,but here you mentioned very good fact :
              "I want it right now and don't want to wait for Slate and Slate probably sucks even though i didn't look into what it is"
              -so you admit the fact that slate isn't ready yet.Yes I hope that one day it could be very good solution for UI.But what I can see now.It is nothing.

              Mr.mikezteh69,completely agree with you.
              Last edited by Korben; 04-15-2014, 10:40 AM.

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                #22
                To add a challenge, Autodesk will give you a Scaleform for UE4 trial free of charge and that comes with access to all documentation and their forums. Adobe will do the same for Flash. If you want to give it a shot first in UE4 vs. UDK.
                Mike "Z"
                UI / Game Designer
                LinkedIn

                Comment


                  #23
                  Scaleform is roughly $295 for a regular license. This is a price based on Windows and as a plugin. So I am not fully sure if that is the same for other platforms and systems. But even $295 is too much for some flashy HUD, rather just use blueprint or slate for free.

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                    #24
                    I suppose it is all about what you want to achieve. I don't have 295.00 but I would find it if it made a difference. Having designed elements for Microsoft, Hasbro Interactive and Wargaming, I guess I have a subtle appreciation for doing things the best you can. Besides...the best things are simply not always free. Now going back to the original post, the question in simple terms was, Is this a tool that you would like to see Epic include licensed as it was with UDK? Just like Speed Tree was to name one of many third party tools.
                    Mike "Z"
                    UI / Game Designer
                    LinkedIn

                    Comment


                      #25
                      Well, I'm mainly a programmer, and I have to say, while I have no problem setting my hud and menu in either C++ or blueprint using canvas, but it's not nowhere close to what you can achieve in much less time with scaleform.

                      I already did a simple hud and pause menu for a small game in blueprint. It has all sorts of simple animations, including blending the color/alpha of the hud elements shortly, moving menus left and right to give it a feel of dynamic pages, etc. . But it's a lot of otherwise unnecessary time/effort spent, and also unless you'll be super organized in how you work in blueprint, the graph tends to get messy pretty quickly.

                      I might not want to buy scaleform for my every single projects using UE4, but having that option gives you a real choice when it comes to UI, especially for some more serious projects, when you have a lot of important parts to take care of and prefer to not spend 3 weeks on a main menu with some effects.

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                        #26
                        Originally posted by Korben View Post
                        sorry guys , didn't want to insult anyone ,again sorry.Xendran ,you wrote very good sentence,I understand that you were talking from my point of view,but here you mentioned very good fact : -so you admit the fact that slate isn't ready yet.Yes I hope that one day it could be very good solution for UI.But what I can see now.It is nothing.

                        Mr.mikezteh69,completely agree with you.
                        I never once said slate was ready to replace scaleform right now or finished. I also used the term "Future Slate".
                        Also you still haven't researched it if you think slate is nothing. Slate is functional, it's just incomplete and does not have WYSIWYG yet.

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by Farshad12 View Post
                          and also unless you'll be super organized in how you work in blueprint, the graph tends to get messy pretty quickly.
                          You want to get good at blueprint organization, or else you're going to have game systems that are a hell of a lot messier than a HUD.
                          Compress and compartmentalize blueprints as much as you can.

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                            #28
                            Originally posted by Xendran View Post
                            You want to get good at blueprint organization, or else you're going to have game systems that are a hell of a lot messier than a HUD.
                            Compress and compartmentalize blueprints as much as you can.
                            Thanks Xendran, but my blueprints are already pretty organized, as I'm a programmer, and by nature I don't move on to the next piece of code when the current one is in bad shape. Even a simple Hud, has 3 functions, and a couple collapsed nodes, plus some cached references in the main graph instead of spagetti looking nodes, all to be complimented by comment boxes.

                            I did however mention, when it comes to hud and menus, right now you have to be *super organized*, meaning more than your usual, otherwise it gets messier than most your graphs. This is not a fault of blueprint, but the lack of a real UI solution at the moment.

                            And did I mention it already takes much more time to setup a UI than scaleform? Now that's excluding the time you need to spend to organize and make the graphs tidy, as well as making extra functions/macros.

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                              #29
                              I want Scaleform. I need Scaleform. They say you should specialize in games development and I chose Scaleform to do so as I come from an actionscript background.

                              I would gladly pay the licence fee if I had even one iota of a chance of getting one but I am a one-man band who is making a game on my own. Every part of it. However I cannot get a licence for Scaleform. So my only option is to try find work for someone who has a licence I can piggy back onto.

                              Considering Scaleform is free for other free engines I believe it should be free for the licenced users of UE4. It feels harsh to deny something like this to those who spent time mastering it with UDK and are expected to update to UE4.

                              Please give us the chance to use it. I don't even ask you to implement it. Let the community figure it out if you have to but please let us use it.
                              http://unrealdeveloper.uk

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                                #30
                                Originally posted by mikezteh69 View Post
                                Well for starters, I want dynamic and animated UI and Menu elements. Maybe it can be done with Blueprint but as of now no one is sharing how. In fact even some Epic people have posted on similar topics that Slate as it stands now might not be the best dynamic UI option. There is no time line currently on a stable build for the WYSIWYG designer for Slate and furthermore, when I say UI I don't mean to limit that to a start screen or health/ammo count. I am talking much larger scale.

                                It is understandable that if you have no need for those features that Slate would be the key back up but with no notable window for completion and my extreme inability to understand how to code anything, a third party application works best.
                                I felt the same way, so I ended up writing my own UI system, and it's working out very nicely so far. I have been trying to make the UI editing system that resembles what I think should have been part of UE4 to begin with.

                                It uses Canvas but extends it with a lot of additional Blueprint functionality and also adds interactive editing with WYSIWYG support.

                                See my thread in the 'Feedback for Epic' subforum: https://forums.unrealengine.com/show...ible-UI-system



                                Last edited by MSE_Taliesin; 05-13-2014, 01:53 PM.

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