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(VIDEO) UE4's Geometry Mode is inadequate when compared with that of Quake 1

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    #16
    Again, not requesting 3ds-max-in-the-editor. Requesting geo tools on par with Quake 1. Not sure where the confusion is here.
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      #17
      Originally posted by JoeWintergreen View Post
      Again, not requesting 3ds-max-in-the-editor. Requesting geo tools on par with Quake 1. Not sure where the confusion is here.
      Quake 1 is almost 20 years old, things have changed.

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        #18
        UE4 has tools that are designed to do the same thing, they've seen recent updates, and they do the same job substantially less well. That Quake is old isn't a good reason for today's tools to be worse. Things haven't changed that much.

        What a weird argument.
        Last edited by JoeWintergreen; 12-27-2014, 10:31 PM.
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          #19
          Hey Joe

          This is an area that Epic is very aware that the community would like to see improved. This topic has come up a number of times before and there are plans to address this in a future release of the engine. There is no specific timeline at the moment of when this will be redone, but it is on the "To do" list.

          If you're not familiar with our public Trello board for UE4 tasks you can take a look here and see it's listed at Geometry 2.0: https://trello.com/c/XfSl7gQf/91-geometry-editor-2-0

          There is a add-on for the Unity Engine, Pro Builder, that the creator of that plugin is looking to port over as a plugin for UE4 which you can see in this forums post: https://forums.unrealengine.com/show...-4-Marketplace

          Thanks,

          Tim
          Tim Hobson | Learning Resources | Epic Games
          UE4 Documentation

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            #20
            Thanks Tim! Mainly made the video because I had trouble quickly articulating exactly what's better about Hammer to Chance in a Skype call the other day. Hope it helps.

            I guess I'd just like to see it moved out of "wishlist". :P
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              #21
              There's so much more involved now that having a complicated mesh in editable state will drag the engine down.
              Dunno why you insist on this, it's not a game mod, I'm afraid you'll have to use Blender/Max/Maya/C4D/etc just like for any other Game Engine, so this all thing about indies leaving doesn't make any sense.

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                #22
                I seriously don't know what you're talking about with statements like this:
                "it's not a game mod, I'm afraid you'll have to use Blender/Max/Maya/C4D/etc just like for any other Game Engine"

                What's not a game mod? "Any other game engine"? I've just shown you a bunch of recent games on other engines that used BSP, and pointed out that having BSP editing tools demonstrably doesn't need to have a significant performance hit on an engine, see probuilder/other engines that have it. tl;dr what are you talking about
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                  #23
                  Originally posted by JoeWintergreen View Post
                  see probuilder/other engines that have it
                  All you've shown is outdated engines (quake 1, source), even the most 'Indie' engine Unity doesn't do this.

                  I said MOD bcz that's the only reason those tools were developed.

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                    #24
                    The only benefit BSP has is that it's already in the engine, so it's faster than switching to a different program and exporting out models.

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                      #25
                      Hi,

                      so it's faster than switching to a different program and exporting out models.
                      Here is an improvement possible:
                      - Add an entry in the context menu for static meshes in the Content browser, right under "Edit mesh". Call it "Edit Datasource"
                      This button then should not open the static mesh editor, but launch the external 3D application (maybe set in the editor preferecnes) with the asset source.
                      For extra convienience, UE4 could also then switch over to that appication (?)
                      + The same could be done for textures, opening the image with photoshop, for example...

                      - Add another setting, either global and/or asset based, called "Volatile". This should be a simple boolean value.
                      If an asset is marked as volatile, the engine checks automatically wether the asset should be reimported.
                      An asset is considered outdated when its timestamp is younger than the date and time of last import.
                      + The reimport check could be done two ways:
                      - periodically, like autosave.
                      - everytime the UE4 application receives focus and becomes active. (Typically after you are done with modifying your assets).
                      In this case, the engine would also know which asset is the candidate for (possible) reimport.

                      From the workflow it would boil down to:
                      - Right-click on asset and choose "Edit Datasource".
                      - modify asset and click on export.
                      - Change back to UE4

                      What are your oppinions on this?

                      Cheers,
                      Klaus

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                        #26
                        Originally posted by Errvald View Post
                        I'd like UE to replace ZBRUSH too but that ain't going to happen
                        Maybe, who knows

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by Errvald View Post
                          All you've shown is outdated engines (quake 1, source), even the most 'Indie' engine Unity doesn't do this.

                          I said MOD bcz that's the only reason those tools were developed.
                          Yes, Unity the best example no comment...
                          Check the all games of Call of Duty series from 2003 to 2014 (Using BSP/GSC ) all maps are different and now check the Battlefield (With Models) all maps with the same house/wall/window model, that is nice...

                          The pros of BSP is create different maps/levels and create that faster than create the same in external editor.
                          You can create the level in BSP and then convert to static mesh where is the problem ?

                          If you make an engine, the idea is give all tools to create what you like/need (your idea).

                          *And no ProBuilder, Cryengine CSG, Cube 2 Sauerbraten, Tesseract aren't a examples of true BSP edit or fast edit. Like Radiant or Hammer are.
                          Last edited by Hevedy; 12-28-2014, 12:10 PM.
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                            #28
                            Originally posted by Hevedy View Post
                            Yes, Unity the best example no comment...
                            Someone mentioned indies leaving for other 'indie' friendly engines due to the lack of this, hence why I mentioned Unity.

                            Originally posted by Hevedy View Post
                            Check the all games of Call of Duty series from 2003 to 2014 (Using BSP/GSC ) all maps are different and now check the Battlefield (With Models) all maps with the same house/wall/window model, that is nice...
                            Those are game specific tools.

                            Originally posted by Hevedy View Post
                            The pros of BSP is create different maps/levels and create that faster than create the same in external editor.
                            You can create the level in BSP and then convert to static mesh where is the problem ?

                            If you make an engine, the idea is give all tools to create what you like/need (your idea).

                            *And no ProBuilder, Cryengine CSG, Cube 2 Sauerbraten, Tesseract aren't a examples of true BSP edit or fast edit. Like Radiant or Hammer are.

                            I want UE4 to be able to sculpt models the same way ZBrush does and then convert them to static meshes, plus I want UE4 to have a UV unwrap tool etc.

                            I'm sorry but BSP are good enough for placeholders, with the hint word here being * PLACEHOLDER *.

                            Don't ask for UE4 to become Pixologic + Autodesk + Adobe.

                            ----------

                            This whole debate comes from people who are used with MODs and thought making 'real' games would be that easy.
                            Last edited by Errvald; 12-28-2014, 12:49 PM.

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                              #29
                              JoeWintergreen totaly agree with you, need normal bsp editor, i hope in future we have it.....

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                                #30
                                Originally posted by Errvald View Post
                                Someone mentioned indies leaving for other 'indie' friendly engines due to the lack of this, hence why I mentioned Unity.



                                Those are game specific tools.




                                I want UE4 to be able to sculpt models the same way ZBrush does and then convert them to static meshes, plus I want UE4 to have a UV unwrap tool etc.

                                I'm sorry but BSP are good enough for placeholders, with the hint word here being * PLACEHOLDER *.

                                Don't ask for UE4 to become Pixologic + Autodesk + Adobe.

                                ----------

                                This whole debate comes from people who are used with MODs and thought making 'real' games would be that easy.
                                Yes, go and say that in the Unreal Tournament 4 forums where all maps now are under GSC/BSP, and to the mappers(hobbyist & professionals) from Call of Duty, Counter, Valve games and other games.
                                And if you haven't used that in your life to create a map why comment about this ?
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