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4.19 & 4.20 Editor & Packaged Games Have Hangs/Hiccups Constantly

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    Originally posted by AHLabrodex View Post


    System Info:
    OS: Windows 10 Home Edition
    CPU: i7 -7700k @ 4.20 GHz
    GPU: Nvidia 1080
    RAM: 32 GB

    It's a pretty nice machine, and I've never had issues like this before on any previous engine versions using the same computer throughout. I am convinced this is an engine regression and has little to nothing to do with graphics drivers in particular.

    My team and I are honestly at this point considering reverting our project back to 4.18.3. This has been the most damaging and disastrous version of the editor I think I have ever used
    Wait till 4.20 then you will see that things can be even worst... Im getting in 3 different projects 40% of the frame rates I was experiencing from 4.16 to 4.19 (in packaged game, not in editor). I have expent 40+ hours digging into 4.20 source code and still not close to discover what is causing it.
    Last edited by NilsonLima; 06-13-2018, 04:53 PM.
    Nilson Lima
    Technical Director @ Rigel Studios Ltda - twitter: @RigelStudios
    Art is a state of Spirit

    Join us at Discord:
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    Comment


      Originally posted by Deathrey View Post
      There is no proper ticker on public issue tracker, that would describe the issue in a sane manner so far.
      Sure, but I think it's reasonable to hope that if Epic could identify and fix the clearly related issues described in the public tracker, they might also have identified and fixed the underlying cause.
      I guess we'll find out in half a year or so.

      Comment


        Originally posted by Efrye View Post
        Sure, but I think it's reasonable to hope that if Epic could identify and fix the clearly related issues described in the public tracker, they might also have identified and fixed the underlying cause.
        I guess we'll find out in half a year or so.
        Sadly, so far there is zero indication of responsible personnel being aware of the issue.
        I just can't find any other explanation why catastrophic regression is not being addressed.


        Originally posted by NilsonLima View Post

        Wait till 4.20 then you will see that things can be even worst... Im getting in 3 different projects 40% of the frame rates I was experiencing from 4.16 to 4.19 (in packaged game, not in editor). I have expent 40+ hours digging into 4.20 source code and still not close to discover what is causing it.
        I could not find the change to blame either.

        Comment


          So after an entire day of running the profiler and almost giving up completely, I stumbled upon a setting nested in the Project Settings > Navigation Mesh > Do Fully Async Nav Data Gathering that resolved our constant hitching.

          In our case, we are using a Persistent Level in which we stream all other levels in from, and our Nav Mesh is placed within the persistent. For some reason, having the navigation mesh not asynchronously gathering navigation data caused our project to have a hitch as if it were a heartbeat. A very consistent hitch that followed a pattern. I am not sure if this setting was reverted or changed during the upgrade between engine versions, but I do know it was not like this in 4.18.3 so whatever the case I still believe there is a bug here.

          In any case, I do not know if this is going to help everyone else as we still notice some random hitching in the engine that doesn't seem to have much of an explanation thus far. Hope this helped anyone struggling with hitching!

          Comment


            Originally posted by AHLabrodex View Post
            So after an entire day of running the profiler and almost giving up completely, I stumbled upon a setting nested in the Project Settings > Navigation Mesh > Do Fully Async Nav Data Gathering that resolved our constant hitching.

            In our case, we are using a Persistent Level in which we stream all other levels in from, and our Nav Mesh is placed within the persistent. For some reason, having the navigation mesh not asynchronously gathering navigation data caused our project to have a hitch as if it were a heartbeat. A very consistent hitch that followed a pattern. I am not sure if this setting was reverted or changed during the upgrade between engine versions, but I do know it was not like this in 4.18.3 so whatever the case I still believe there is a bug here.

            In any case, I do not know if this is going to help everyone else as we still notice some random hitching in the engine that doesn't seem to have much of an explanation thus far. Hope this helped anyone struggling with hitching!
            Thanks for providing a potential fix, I hope it will help some people struggling with this issue. For our project however this doesn't seem to help. The project I'm working on is just a demo without any nav mesh volumes in the world but tried this out regardless, however I don't see any difference in this project.

            Seems to be somehow related to reflection capture in our case best I can tell, we use a very large planar reflection component on top of the ocean surface. I am assuming this is why the hitching is so bad in this project, it jumps from 11ms frametime to 100ms or more, it gets so bad sometimes the engine freezes for over a second on a PC with an 8700k and GTX1080.

            And 4.20 is definitely worse.

            Problem is I can't figure out what triggers it and it doesn't happen all the time making it next to impossible to create a bug report for it. Even if I could reproduce it regularly there are already 2 bug reports in this thread anyways. This is a critical issue. 4.19 and 4.20 are essentially unusable to create a game using this or any of the other projects discussed in this thread.

            It's frustrating not being able to solve this and not hearing anything from Epic on the matter doesn't help the situation. This thread is a prime example of how the new bug reporting system is failing us end users. At least before we could go through and try the steps listed on AnswerHub by Epic staff to see if it helped our situation, now we have 10+ threads both here and on AnswerHub for the same issue without any visible support provided by Epic.

            As someone who used to work in a support role this drives me crazy seeing the amount of support decrease when it should be the opposite. I really hope you guys take a look at the before and after from our perspective, including overall community sentiment stemming from this reduction in visible support, and try to remedy the situation in the near future.

            Thank you
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            Comment


              I've got to say it's pretty frustrating not having an engineer respond to this thread, especially given that someone has provided a test project and several repro cases. 4.19 was a nightmare build for me on multiple counts.

              Comment


                Dear Kalvothe , to sum up whats going on is a sentiment that 4.19 came to release with a severe regression issue that is not receiving the care it deserves. Please, get close with some dev and make sure this will not slip to further engine releases as it is, because it will greatly impact projects, meaning there will be probably no game or product being developed with this release, because it is unusable.
                Nilson Lima
                Technical Director @ Rigel Studios Ltda - twitter: @RigelStudios
                Art is a state of Spirit

                Join us at Discord:
                https://discord.gg/uFFSEXY
                UE4 Marketplace:
                Cloudscape Seasons

                Comment


                  For God's sake won't someone here just 'Pay the Ransom'.
                  Clearly Amanda.Bott & Kalvothe have been kidnapped....
                  By Fortnite hackers demanding a ransom of loot boxes etc!

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by DotCam View Post
                    And 4.20 is definitely worse.
                    The hitching left aside, after upgrading a copy of blueprint draw to render target-based FFT water project from 4.18 to 4.19, I noticed almost 40% increased frame times.




                    Originally posted by AHLabrodex View Post
                    So after an entire day of running the profiler and almost giving up completely, I stumbled upon a setting nested in the Project Settings > Navigation Mesh > Do Fully Async Nav Data Gathering that resolved our constant hitching.

                    In our case, we are using a Persistent Level in which we stream all other levels in from, and our Nav Mesh is placed within the persistent. For some reason, having the navigation mesh not asynchronously gathering navigation data caused our project to have a hitch as if it were a heartbeat. A very consistent hitch that followed a pattern. I am not sure if this setting was reverted or changed during the upgrade between engine versions, but I do know it was not like this in 4.18.3 so whatever the case I still believe there is a bug here.

                    In any case, I do not know if this is going to help everyone else as we still notice some random hitching in the engine that doesn't seem to have much of an explanation thus far. Hope this helped anyone struggling with hitching!
                    Thanks for posting how your resolved your issue. Apparently yours one was unrelated.
                    There was a mix of things here and there within the thread, so I will post a brief recap of the issue.


                    The issue: Hitches on the rendering thread, progressively worsening with time, accompanied by a memory leak. Reliable.

                    Details: The buildup of hitches and rate of memory leak depends on performing certain actions. Buildup can take from hours to minutes, depending on actions and how often they are performed.
                    Full list of actions is unknown.
                    The actions include, but are not limited to:

                    Drawing to a render target from blueprint. Reliable.

                    Areas affected: Editor and packaged products, both dev and shipping configs. Reliable

                    Versions affected: 4.19.0 and onward, launcher and source built. Reliable.

                    Systems affected: Including but questionably not limited to W7 and W10. Unreliable. At least two developers mentioned the same symptoms on iOS. Not enough linux devs around to conclude.

                    Hardware affected: Nvidia cards with drivers newer than 385.69. Unreliable. At least two developers mentioned the same symptoms on mobile. Not enough machines with ATI cards around.

                    Additional information:
                    For those, who experience the issue and have Nvidia cards, rolling driver back to 385.69 seems to solve the issue. Reliable.
                    memreport does not account for memory leak anywhere, apart from process memory. Reliable.


                    Do correct me, if I omitted anything of importance or if you have something confirmed to add.
                    Last edited by Deathrey; 06-15-2018, 05:33 PM.

                    Comment


                      Deathrey

                      Maybe Epic is ignoring this issue because this threads title makes it (incorrectly) sound as if this would only be an issue with the editor, while it does actually appear same in packaged builds, which is obviously way worse since it means every player of a game is affected by it. I'd say you should create a new thread with a correct title and put that post you just did into there. Maybe that will finally make them pay some attention.
                      Easy to use UMG Mini Map on the UE4 Marketplace.
                      Forum thread: https://forums.unrealengine.com/show...-Plug-and-Play

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by John Alcatraz View Post
                        Deathrey

                        Maybe Epic is ignoring this issue because this threads title makes it (incorrectly) sound as if this would only be an issue with the editor, while it does actually appear same in packaged builds, which is obviously way worse since it means every player of a game is affected by it. I'd say you should create a new thread with a correct title and put that post you just did into there. Maybe that will finally make them pay some attention.
                        Agreed. My original spawn of this thread and example video etc. were my limited specific problem/symptoms, not the educated bigger picture causes and root of the issues everyone is having. A new thread with accurate title and current research provided is warranted.

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by John Alcatraz View Post
                          Deathrey

                          Maybe Epic is ignoring this issue because this threads title makes it (incorrectly) sound as if this would only be an issue with the editor, while it does actually appear same in packaged builds, which is obviously way worse since it means every player of a game is affected by it. I'd say you should create a new thread with a correct title and put that post you just did into there. Maybe that will finally make them pay some attention.
                          You have a point. I actually used to have a thread about it with bug/regression tag, until I was pointed here.

                          On the other hand, if thread editor tag is sufficient enough to justify simply skipping a thread in feedback forum, that had been afloat for two months, linked to in a bug report, and mentioned while tagging community manager and project coordinator... nah. That would be just disrespectful not to skim through 10 pages.

                          Either the number of reports is too low, or the issue was looked into and the cause was not identified, or there is simply broken telephone all along.

                          I'm not developing any project of my own, just a contractor. Not affected by the issue directly, just one of those, advising on feasibility and risks of upgrading the project and doing a courtesy of bringing attention to issue, severity and scale of which was greatly underestimated. And I am stoned with the fact that nothing appears to be done to investigate it.

                          Bug reporting system depicting a bouncer instead of investigator will inevitably spirals towards reduction in number and quality of reports.
                          Last edited by Deathrey; 06-15-2018, 07:45 PM.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by John Alcatraz View Post
                            Deathrey

                            Maybe Epic is ignoring this issue because this threads title makes it (incorrectly) sound as if this would only be an issue with the editor, while it does actually appear same in packaged builds, which is obviously way worse since it means every player of a game is affected by it. I'd say you should create a new thread with a correct title and put that post you just did into there. Maybe that will finally make them pay some attention.
                            Thanks, that's a good point. I have renamed the thread as: "4.19 & 4.20 Editor & Packaged Games Have Hangs/Hiccups Constantly"

                            Originally posted by Motus Digital View Post
                            Agreed. My original spawn of this thread and example video etc. were my limited specific problem/symptoms, not the educated bigger picture causes and root of the issues everyone is having. A new thread with accurate title and current research provided is warranted.
                            That would fragment the discussion making it more difficult to get a proper response which from my experience as a mod it is highly beneficial for both us and them to keep the discussion in one place. We have somewhat hijacked this thread, apologies for that, but I think the discussions that have taken place in this thread could help Epic figure out the cause since people have been trying to troubleshoot along the way, which has been great, thank you guys!
                            Free Community Ocean & Sky Project || Join us on Discord! || Trello Roadmap

                            Comment


                              Hi all,

                              I am experiencing exactly the same issues as the ones described in this thread using 4.19.2. The hitches worsen over the length of time the editor is left open. I'm going to try to rollback to 4.18 for now because 4.19.2 is unusable in both the sense of not being able to work inside the editor due to the hitches and the sense that building using this version would mean users would also experience these issues in game.

                              I am using Nvidia GTX 1060 with latest drivers.
                              .

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by DotCam View Post

                                Thanks, that's a good point. I have renamed the thread as: "4.19 & 4.20 Editor & Packaged Games Have Hangs/Hiccups Constantly"
                                Not sure if you're aware, but this post still has the [EDITOR] tag.
                                Easy to use UMG Mini Map on the UE4 Marketplace.
                                Forum thread: https://forums.unrealengine.com/show...-Plug-and-Play

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