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Sharp decline in Official Responses from Epic throughout the community.

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    #91
    Originally posted by BrUnO XaVIeR View Post
    No; but indie devs and small studios are completely dependent on community. If UE4 community shrinks while Lumberyard's or Unity's increase, for indies using UE4 that becomes a major problem overtime.

    Epic is going be just fine, I'm much more worried about the community around Unreal Engine and new comers giving up because they receive 0% backup.
    Agreed. The longer I am part of the UE4 community, the more I am annoyed by the lack of community support by Epic, not to mention the marketplace is a disaster where most assets shouldn't ever have gotten through their "quality control".


    Originally posted by BrUnO XaVIeR View Post
    This is very serious; I've seen all this happen before ( Torque engine's community, CryEngine's, Unity's)...
    Users began to give up those communities and flow away to something else.

    4 years ago Unity pretty much had an exodus of users due to very familiar reasons discussed here.

    [...]

    Meanwhile, Epic took opposite path... Communication is lacking, documentation is a big mess, training is community driven, user feedback is ignored, bug reports are ignored for months, roadmap is gone, engine improvement is entirely guided by Epic's own internal game projects only.

    So, where do think all of this is going?
    I've been told by projects leads to evaluate and learn other engines already, such as Lumberyard, "-just in case".
    This. I have the feeling that Epic is catering more and more to the big businesses & titles that make them a lot of money, and more and more ignore the indie devs and the "free" community. Which is crazy, because without the community, there wouldn't be any way for newcomers to learn how to use the Engine at all. Not to mention the Engine wouldn't even be where it is right now.


    Originally posted by BrUnO XaVIeR View Post
    So, where do think all of this is going?
    I've been told by projects leads to evaluate and learn other engines already, such as Lumberyard, "-just in case".
    I will finish my current project in UE4, and then move on to Lumberyard or Unity, to never come back. It's just too much a waste of time and money trying to find good answers to engine / blueprint problems, "testing" broken marketplace assets or after 6 versions (I started around 4.12) to be still hoping Epic will finally decide to give dynamic lighting / open worlds some love.


    Last edited by spacegojira; 11-08-2017, 06:18 AM.

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      #92
      Originally posted by spacegojira View Post
      I have the feeling that Epic is catering more and more to the big businesses & titles that make them a lot of money, and more and more ignore the indie devs and the "free" community. Which is crazy, because without the community, there wouldn't be any way for newcomers to learn how to use the Engine at all.
      There's a sense of injustice here underlying the stuff you wrote above, but for quite different reasons.
      In the early days many Indie devs, some even in this exact thread helped provide valuable feedback.
      That led to useful contributions and making UE4 more stable. Some got credit some didn't, that's life.

      Others went on to build up Community-Tools and also provide tutorials that have helped lots of devs.
      What happens next time Epic call on the community. Will it be there for them? Possibly, maybe not!
      Epic probably see 'Gaming-as-a-Service' as freeing them from ever needing 'mega-launches' again....

      Originally posted by spacegojira View Post
      I will finish my current project in UE4, and then move on to Lumberyard or Unity, to never come back
      No, do it for the right reasons dude. Because LY etc, has something that UE4 lacks!
      Otherwise, you just risk exchanging one set of unique problems for another, that's all...
      Also, how are the docs / community samples in LY right now atm? Do the R&D asap!
      LY is a threat to Epic long-term, AMZN resources / infrastructure could crush anyone!

      Anyway forgive the digression Victor, back to the thread and AH...

      Comment


        #93
        Originally posted by franktech View Post
        No, do it for the right reasons dude. Because LY etc, has something that UE4 lacks!
        Otherwise, you just risk exchanging one set of unique problems for another, that's all...
        Also, how are the docs / community samples in LY right now atm? Do the R&D asap!
        LY is a threat to Epic long-term, AMZN resources / infrastructure could crush anyone!
        You are right. I was a bit depressed after days trying to get broken shadows fixed, just to see that Epic still hasn't responded to the problem since 4.13..

        Lumberyard, being the CryEngine, has the best features when it comes to dynamic lighting & open world, which is really what I need for my future dream "exploration game". The AWS implementation is amazing too.

        In my opinion, the docs are actually better than Epics, which are mostly outdated or very limited. They have well explained videos for almost every feature, which is great. And just look at their Youtube channel, they are going crazy with adding new tutorial videos.

        They also keep making nice updates, and the build in engines kinda blew me away. For example it took me sooooo long to get basic lighting and a day-night-cycle working in UE4, and it still has a lot of problems due to the engines dynamic lighting problems.
        Now I just found this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-KdwKZtzzo0 honestly it makes me sad how much time I wasted trying to get that simple stuff working in the unreal engine..

        Also, being a visual design nerd, LY has such a great looking UI compared to the ugly, ancient interface of UE4! It's such a pain to use the unreal editor, especially on a small screen.


        To be fair, I love the UE4 blueprint system, but LY is building something very similiar. See this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-zNVytjan7w

        The only reason why I keep working with Unreal Engine and aren't switching over is that I already put so much work (and learning time) into my UE4 project, which would feel like a waste to abandon now. And because I don't want to spend another year getting to the same level I am in UE4 now.

        Oh, that and the hundreds of euros (dollars) I spend on the marketplace. :P

        Comment


          #94
          To be fair I think some of the doom and gloom here is getting out of hand. The only reason why LY / Unity etc. are looking so good now is because you haven't dug deep enough to find the actual issues (for Unity you won't have to dig deep). People mustn't forget that UE4 is industry-hardened and extremely powerful. The issue here was never the capabilities of the engine, it's not even documentation really. Creating a dynamic day / night cycle properly is something that's beyond the scope of any document (more like a book in its own right), so documenting that isn't happening any time. What's REALLY missing is dev support to assist you as you learn all the bits and pieces that go into something as complex as that.
          [Submitted] Advanced Data Validation

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            #95
            Originally posted by DamirH View Post
            What's REALLY missing is dev support to assist you as you learn all the bits and pieces that go into something as complex as that.
            Especially when it comes to animation and AI (and tying those two together).

            Comment


              #96
              What puts you off about the engine at a first glance is the unfortunate interface design, I think it looks like it came from windows 95 with one of those themes installed. Not to mention that it's slow as hell, the thing must be eating 10 percent of your GPU alone.

              Seriously if that one thing was more on the minimalist and functional side and less on the flashy side, things may have picked up a little better with some more serious newcomers. To go from a 3d software to that thing was and still is a confusing mess compared to how smooth the transition was to Unity. In unreal I'm still confused at the amount of BP windows i need to have open and which one should be clicked on for a specific task. Just make it unified. All animations happen in X all programming happen in Y and so on. It's really not that much of a rocket science.Remove all the colors and bulky icons keep them where it matters, make the interface more monochromatic dark like in Max, Maya, Unity etc.. keep things functional.

              For the record no one is here to 'teach' Epic how to do things, it's just frustrating to see a monster engine let down by such poor initial choices. There's much potential here but the direction is either all over or nonexistent, especially on priorities.


              Comment


                #97
                Originally posted by William K View Post
                What puts you off about the engine at a first glance is the unfortunate interface design, I think it looks like it came from windows 95 with one of those themes installed. Not to mention that it's slow as hell, the thing must be eating 10 percent of your GPU alone.
                This post has nothing to do with the topic. I think complains about the engine itself go into another thread

                Comment


                  #98

                  Originally posted by spacegojira View Post
                  Also, being a visual design nerd, LY has such a great looking UI compared to the ugly, ancient interface of UE4! It's such a pain to use the unreal editor, especially on a small screen.
                  Originally posted by William K View Post
                  What puts you off about the engine at a first glance is the unfortunate interface design, I think it looks like it came from windows 95 with one of those themes installed. Not to mention that it's slow as hell, the thing must be eating 10 percent of your GPU alone.
                  [... ]Remove all the colors and bulky icons keep them where it matters, make the interface more monochromatic dark like in Max, Maya, Unity etc.. keep things functional.
                  Apart from that it has nothing to do with this thread, I want to note that I absolutely disagree with you on that. The UE4 UI is extremely awesome and way, way better than anything that Lumberyard or Unity has. The whole UI being monochromatic dark like in lumberyard looks very unpleasent and its just a very hostile UI that stops people from even trying the software. Software like maya and 3ds max all have this very hostile UI that makes it very hard to learn how to actually use it.

                  With UE4, you quickly find what you look for, even if you're not too familiar with it. And UE4 just looks way, way better. Lumberyard is really what looks like windows 95.

                  You want UE4 to go back to the UDK look, which is quite similar to Lumberyard if you think about UDK just with monochromatic grey icons. And UE4 was a huge improvement over UDK, especially regarding the UI.
                  Last edited by John Alcatraz; 11-09-2017, 11:44 AM.
                  Easy to use UMG Mini Map on the UE4 Marketplace.
                  Forum thread: https://forums.unrealengine.com/show...-Plug-and-Play

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                    #99
                    Originally posted by John Alcatraz View Post




                    Apart from that it has nothing to do with this thread, I want to note that I absolutely disagree with you on that. The UE4 UI is extremely awesome and way, way better than anything that Lumberyard or Unity has. The whole UI being monochromatic dark like in lumberyard looks very unpleasent and its just a very hostile UI that stops people from even trying the software. Software like maya and 3ds max all have this very hostile UI that makes it very hard to learn how to actually use it.

                    With UE4, you quickly find what you look for, even if you're not too familiar with it. And UE4 just looks way, way better. Lumberyard is really what looks like windows 95.

                    You want UE4 to go back to the UDK look, which is quite similar to Lumberyard if you think about UDK just with monochromatic grey icons. And UE4 was a huge improvement over UDK, especially regarding the UI.
                    You guys are correct this is off thread I noticed after I wrote it, my apologies. But I still disagree about the UI though .

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by John Alcatraz View Post
                      Apart from that it has nothing to do with this thread, I want to note that I absolutely disagree with you on that. The UE4 UI is extremely awesome and way, way better than anything that Lumberyard or Unity has. The whole UI being monochromatic dark like in lumberyard looks very unpleasent and its just a very hostile UI that stops people from even trying the software. Software like maya and 3ds max all have this very hostile UI that makes it very hard to learn how to actually use it.

                      With UE4, you quickly find what you look for, even if you're not too familiar with it. And UE4 just looks way, way better. Lumberyard is really what looks like windows 95.

                      You want UE4 to go back to the UDK look, which is quite similar to Lumberyard if you think about UDK just with monochromatic grey icons. And UE4 was a huge improvement over UDK, especially regarding the UI.
                      Seriously? Are we looking at the same program? If you let a 5 year old draw a UI, then you get the same bloated, clumsy interface. The only thing is missing is a comic sans font for the text.

                      Comment


                        You know, UE4 sources are open for developers - you could always go and rewrite UI to whatever you fancy. You don't have skills to do it properly? Sorry, but it's impossible to fit all the preferences of everyone at the same time while still developing new way more important features.

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                          wow does seems like almost everybody has abandoned ue4
                          forums are very quiet
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                            Back to subject matter what i've personally complained about Epic is that they really lack some direction when it comes to priorities. Their staff and employees seem like very nice and incredibly capable people but consider this that happened to us last time.

                            Simple question: How do you link normal maps to morph targets in UE?

                            Step one: Jump to Docs... No specific doc found (at least in our search), we do find something similar about linking colored values in mat editor to create glowing eyes... Read through it quickly nothing to do with morphs or normals (for now), jump to next parallel search.

                            Step two: Youtube! Behold livestream on morph targets and normal maps!... This is is it! Goldmine of information 1 hour coverage discussing what we need to know!

                            Great, press play and we start watching.... 20 mins through and we are still stuck in 3ds max and the poor staff is absolutely wasting his time, Livestream time and our time explaining what the hell morph targets are!!! I mean the guy means very well that i understand but you don't spend 15 - 20 mins of a very limited precious time explaining the most basic thing just so some possible kid somewhere graduating from kinder garden can understand it, such a kid has no place to even be using UE in the first place if he doesn't know what morph targets are!!

                            To top it all off the livestream ends and normal map linking to morph are not covered!

                            Step three: forum search, no results everyone asking same question getting no answer.

                            Step four: go back to docs and check out the color mat page again, I read something about instances and values, I blindly open up UE and tell myself to just create same naming convention that matches the morph target's one, MAYBE that will work.

                            By a miracle it was that simple and it did! After I wasted almost 1 and a half hours of looking for it and simply got lucky in the end.

                            And i've seen this exact thing happen in most livestreams, important issues are bypassed to please the starter kits of the crowd. every minute of Epic staff are precious to UE users, they want to suck that information out for as long as they can from them in this world of lack of information, which is why it gets sad to see such given time wasted sometimes.


                            Comment


                              Well, all I have to say, since I just finished up the MegaJam playthru stream is that my GameJam feedback wasn't given much consideration in the four months since I first proposed it:

                              https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...h.8ujzahfgk2p1

                              Only thing they took were 3/4th of my submission form idea.

                              Website/Portfolio: http://www.VictorBurgosGames.com

                              Join me on stream: https://www.twitch.tv/VictorBurgosGames for UE4 Game Dev. If you need help, just stop by and ask!

                              Currently looking for exciting new opportunities! Available for work!
                              https://forums.unrealengine.com/comm...ars-experience

                              Comment


                                Hey folks,

                                I wanted to chime in and hopefully address some of your concerns on a number of a different fronts.

                                AnswerHub & Bug Reports
                                AnswerHub is a community-run support site where we encourage UE4 developers to support each other by providing practical solutions for hurdles encountered during development. We’ve spent time on the site in the past helping out as we can, but our primary activity there is to work through bug reports found by the community, as that is where they’re currently logged.

                                UDN is a private channel for teams with custom license agreement terms with Epic, and it is used as the primary support path for those developers. Although many issues and requests that affect everyone will appear on both AnswerHub and UDN, there is a bias towards UDN as Epic must provide direct support there as part of those agreements. The good news is that many fixes for issues found by UDN users make their way into binary releases before they’re plaguing too many other people.

                                UDN is not our only focus, of course. We absolutely encourage you to utilize the voting systems, for both AnswerHub and on Issues, to help raise visibility for issues that have the most impact on the community at large. This helps us further prioritize bugs and questions, and weigh these against other internal needs.

                                All stability issues and bugs are taken seriously by the engine team. Your feedback, especially during the preview releases, is invaluable. We try to fix as many bugs and quality of life issues as we can pre-release, and then if we miss anything significant, we work to address that in hotfixes as quickly as possible. We aim for a balance between fixing bugs, improving usability and adding new features.

                                Often times, bugs that are reported are more like feature requests. What may appear to be a bug is simply how something was designed. We have to take into account the engineers involved and the technical tradeoffs to implement such items and prioritize accordingly.

                                We understand that the current process is not ideal, so we are investigating options for improving the bug reporting process, such as a template or form. This is very much in the research stage, but I wanted to let you know it’s something we’re working on.

                                Documentation
                                We are soon going to be rolling out new processes with our documentation that will improve your access to more up-to-date information. Hopefully this will help alleviate some of the strain on AnswerHub.
                                Jeff has posted details over here.
                                (Please post any doc related comments or questions over there!)

                                Forum / Feedback for Epic Thread
                                Community and engine folks alike regularly check the forums, but again, the dev teams are always having to prioritize their efforts. I'll work on taking the time to make sure you see us here, even if it's an "I don't know" or "let me look into that for you,” and help point folks back your way where possible.

                                We're also in the process of growing our community team, so that we can have more eyes and ears looking out for you, across all our sites. Please know that we’re still fighting for you, even if you don’t always hear from us.

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